WebM Labs release

May 20, 2010 · by Ruari Ødegaard

As you have probably already heard, yesterday Opera released a Labs build with WebM support. You can find out more details in our Labs announcement, Opera dev article or Philip Jägenstedt's blog post (Philip leads our HTML5 video effort).

This post is provided to give you all a place to share your thoughts on this historic announcement. However as always, stay on topic. Comments should be about video support (specifically WebM video support). Remember that Labs releases are not snapshots, they serve to demonstrate new and ground breaking features we are working on. That said, they still are not meant for regular usage, since they do share the same potential for serious bugs as the snapshots do.

EDIT: We have made a small tweak to the Linux packages so that they should work on a wider range of distros. If WebM wasn't working for you before please re-download the package and try again.

Readers' comments

Comments left by My Opera members under the original post: the first 50, as archived.

Zimak20. May 2010, 09:16
testing...
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 09:23
P.S. See also the Choose Opera blog post for further comments from users and also the thread in the Beta forum.
Abhishek Thakur20. May 2010, 09:24
Onegin Evgeniu20. May 2010, 09:24
why 21868 bild ??? if last 10.54 bild 3390 !
Abhishek Thakur20. May 2010, 09:28
Originally posted by OneginUA:

why 21868 bild ??? if last 10.54 bild 3390 !

Because its a labs build separate from 10.5x branch.
alexey-u20. May 2010, 09:28
YouTube works ok! It's really cool!

But it obviously must have a video download indicator to be able to replace flash version.

Thank you! Hope you will add this feature before release will be made:)
hurug20. May 2010, 09:28
Tkanks Devs. Testing already.
cyberdude m20. May 2010, 09:29
thanks for giving us new snapshot.....though late:lol:
berend ytsma20. May 2010, 09:30
Originally posted by minicyberdude:

thanks for giving us new snapshot.....though late:lol:

It's no snapshot, it's an labs release
i4u120. May 2010, 09:34
And when the "true" new snapshot will be?
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 09:37
@Linux users: Just to clarify, the "Ubuntu" label on the Linux builds reflects the fact that due to tight time scales we did not have time to test a full range of distros. It works in recent Ubuntu and I can confirm having tested it myself that it works in Archlinux. However there is an issue with some Debian based distros. My advice would be to try it and see if it works for you.

The easiest way to run this is to run it 'in place', i.e.
```
$ tar xf opera-10.54-21867-webm.i386.linux.tar.bz2

$ opera-10.54-21867-webm.i386.linux/opera &
```
If you really want to use your main profile (which is not at all recommended but your final choice), change that last line to:
```
$ opera-10.54-21867-webm.i386.linux/opera -pd ~/.opera &
```
Alternatively, you can use the included install script to install it but we would then recommend that you install with a suffix to allow it to run alongside your main install.
Rafał Miłecki20. May 2010, 09:37
Using Linux I get "Your browser does not currently recognize any of the video formats available." on Youtube.

If so you, check console output. I noticed "undefined symbol: g_realloc_n" and "version `GLIBC_2.11' not found".

You have to have glibc 2.11 installed, in case of openSUSE 11.2 it's glibc 2.10.
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 09:39
Originally posted by Zajec:

You have to have glibc 2.11 installed.
This is the issue in my previous comment about not working on all distros. It'll be fixed but unfortunately for now you will not be able to test, sorry.
cyberdude m20. May 2010, 09:42
Originally posted by ytsmabeer:

It's no snapshot, it's an labs release

ohh.....ok...so when will the new snapshot come out?
Florin Iacob20. May 2010, 09:49
How will this relate to the snapshots? Will the next snapshot(s) include this functionality?
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 09:49
Originally posted by Mastema:

Will the next snapshot(s) include this functionality?
Not the next one but support will appear once we have done a little bit more work to stabilise things.

@all: please, enough comments about when new snapshots will be released. They don't have a fixed time scale for when they come out. Now back on topic please.
Sander Evers20. May 2010, 09:51
Doesn't work on youtube (Win7 X64) still getting the flash videos (yes I enabled youtube.com/html5)
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 09:53
Originally posted by elfsander:

Doesn't work on youtube (Win7 X64) still getting the flash videos (yes I enabled youtube.com/html5)
Not all videos are transcoded to WebM format yet so for all others (the vast majority) you will get the Flash version. Test with the examples we linked to in the Labs and Dev articles.
berend ytsma20. May 2010, 09:54
Originally posted by elfsander:

Doesn't work on youtube (Win7 X64) still getting the flash videos (yes I enabled youtube.com/html5)

Does work but you'll have o do

1. Search for a video by keyword. For example, trailers.
2. In the browser’s address bar, add &webm=1 to the end of the URL. For example, http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=trailers&aq=f&webm=1.
3. Press Enter.
hcym20. May 2010, 10:10
really cool
OperaDrBruce20. May 2010, 10:17
Originally posted by ruario:

@all: please, enough comments about when new snapshots will be released. They don't have a fixed time scale for when they come out. Now back on topic please.
BecDeXorbin20. May 2010, 10:20
VP8 pretty much sucks ass: http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=377
Rafał Miłecki20. May 2010, 10:30
Originally posted by ruario:

t about not working on all distros. It'll be fixed but unfortunately for now you will not be able to test, sorry.
Sure, it's OK. Just wanted to let other ppl know issue Some may want to try update glibc.
Rafał Miłecki20. May 2010, 10:32
Originally posted by BecDeXorbin:

VP8 pretty much sucks ass: http://x264dev.multimedia.cx/?p=377

Please, read http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikitech-l/2010-May/047795.html as well. It's not sooo bad and there is place for real improvements.
SteveKong20. May 2010, 10:32
I'd like to know whether Opera sees any patent issues with WebM and Theora, as some others do.
Trizen20. May 2010, 10:37
Working fine here (Arch Linux), but 720p is not working so well.. (tested on Opera 10.50 YouTube video)
Roman20. May 2010, 10:40
Originally posted by Zajec:

If so you, check console output. I noticed "undefined symbol: g_realloc_n" and "version `GLIBC_2.11' not found".

hm.. same for me on debian lenny

waiting ...
(works in chrome 6 from dev channel )
arekm20. May 2010, 10:42
Originally posted by Zajec:

g_realloc_n

It's from glib and not glibc. So you also need new glib.
MaxFragg20. May 2010, 10:42
arg @AnuaR Sh LABS != Snapshots/Desktoptream 2 branches with different goals.

nice build, works quite well on ubuntu 10.04 /x86
harcalion20. May 2010, 10:45
Performance is not good at all (with Elephant's dream video sample). About 65% CPU. Better for Adriana Lima's video, about 30%. Room for improvement... yes, I think so.

Specs: Windows 7 x64 (Intel E6600)
Geforce GTS 250 (I doubt it's GPU-accelerated but even so).

But, again, thanks for an alternative to H.264.
Шуйский Николай [krigstask, Ŝtérkrìg]20. May 2010, 10:47
How it would be implemented in mainline Opera? I mean, on *nix Opera can play every format Gstreamer supports, so WebM support is really a question of writing a plugin, pushing it to mainline and then to major distros. Am I right?
netwolf20. May 2010, 10:49
Originally posted by Rafał Miłecki:

It's not sooo bad and there is place for real improvements.

What makes me worry a bit is that Google calls the specs 'final'.
This makes any real improvments to the core/codec pretty hard I'm afraid...

ot: I understand the lab builds are from a different branch, but what build are they based on? Latest snapshot build? Any other changes?
eliotcougar20. May 2010, 10:50
I've tried it yesterday... Be careful, the installer does seem to ignore "Use as default browser" and "Place icon on Desktop" options... I had to uninstall it very soon and restore 10.53 installation in Repair mode, not sure it works properly now...

I hope VP8 encoder/decoder will be more "developed" when it reach version 1.0.0... And only then it should be widely used to convert old videos and encode new ones... Right now it gives noticeably worse quality than H264 and noticeably lower encode/decode speed... Current encoder skips frames and breaks some videos... Moreover, current HTML5-Video implementation lacks a lot of "definitely-must-have" features (Fullscreen, better seeking, streaming, subtitles and so on... Some already present in YouTube flash video-player)...

I know, the society (especially iPad fans) urge for open video on the net, but if you will release incomplete, bugged, crashing piece of software again (like it was with Opera 10.5) it will be epic fail... Don't hurry with the release, users should have patience...
And Google should perfect their WebM standard along with VP8 encoder/decoder before they will be included in "All Modern Browsers"...

Anyway, WebM support looks quite safe to be included in weekly Opera 10.54+ snapshots, not only in labs builds... It's tricky to have them installed alongside... The actual code associated with WebM is triggered only on video elements which are not widespread enough to cause problems for regular users...

I vote for GStreamer update in weekly builds...
apass20. May 2010, 10:53
I'm not liking the feel of the youtube html5 video player
1)The video doesn't pause & buffer on a slow network
2)Instead it plays like a video slideshow
3)No download progress bar
nimu_chan20. May 2010, 10:57
eliotcougar20. May 2010, 10:58
Originally posted by apass:

I'm not liking the feel of the DEFAULT/preview-stage/tech-demo/incomplete/for-demonstration-purposes youtube html5 video player
1)The video doesn't pause & buffer on a slow network
2)Instead it plays like a video slideshow
3)No download progress bar

A lot of features (not all) could be implemented using just a bunch of JavaScript code, a bit of CSS3 and some SVG or Canvas elements... Customization looks even easier than in Flash...
ouzoWTF20. May 2010, 11:01
timeshifting in a YT video is ignored when 720p is activated
pieRr0Ur20. May 2010, 11:23
Yep, saw this one on Choose Opera.
figarofigarofigaro20. May 2010, 11:33
I was thinking that RC linux has come...

So with this webM thing stable release for linux is going to postponed like 6 months, maybe more....

There were 3 stable realeses for windows of 10.5x, and at the same time none for linux...
bhelyer20. May 2010, 11:35
I am running Karmic, and the builds don't work for me either (they run, but video doesn't work with the GLIBC_2_11 issue that everyone else has had), so you should probably mark the builds as '10.04' only, as that's how it appears to be (at least age wise)
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 12:17
Originally posted by figarofigarofigaro:

So with this webM thing stable release for linux is going to postponed like 6 months, maybe more....
This has zero effect on how soon a Linux stable comes out. The developers working on video are not the same ones working on desktop UNIX.
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 12:18
Originally posted by bhelyer:

I am running Karmic, and the builds don't work for me either (they run, but video doesn't work with the GLIBC_2_11 issue that everyone else has had), so you should probably mark the builds as '10.04' only, as that's how it appears to be (at least age wise)
Yes you are correct. This will only work on bleeding edge distros at the moment.
Federico20. May 2010, 12:29
testing on youtube @720p getting 134% cpu ussage. 2.56 13" macbook pro with 9400M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0dE23jVLXw

also did not find the full screen button
also also otherwise is working ok.
z@h3k20. May 2010, 12:34
Daniel James Hendrycks20. May 2010, 12:51
All works fine, hope the snapshots after the upcoming one keep including WebM.
Kirilo8120. May 2010, 12:57
The built works on OpenSuse 11.3 (which has glibc 2.11), but it doesn't play anything (you just see the html5 loading indication).

On the console I get the same output as for the non-working flash video:

opera: Plug-in 9312 is not responding. It will be closed.
opera: Define environment variable OPERA_KEEP_BLOCKED_PLUGIN to keep blocked plug-ins.
Charlie Clark20. May 2010, 13:18
Congratulations to all involved. Kudos to Opera for introducing the <video> tag in the first place and hats off to Google for biting the bullet, buying the company, releasing the source and preparing to take on the copyright lobby. Google isn't really being altruistic on this but it still takes courage to take these lobbies on.

Now that video is sorted, can we please concentrate on the rest of HTML5...
Ruari Ødegaard20. May 2010, 14:02
Originally posted by Kirilo81:

opera: Plug-in 9312 is not responding. It will be closed.

opera: Define environment variable OPERA_KEEP_BLOCKED_PLUGIN to keep blocked plug-ins.
You must have Flash or some other plugin running as well. That error comes from the plugin wrapper which is not used by opera for WebM content. It is likely unrelated to your problems of running WebM content.
F.V.20. May 2010, 14:03
My major concern about the UI side of Opera's <video> implementation is that Opera doesn't show any controls for non-autoplaying videos. Only when hovering or keyboard-focusing do I get the controls. This is very bad usability because people don't see that it's an interactive element - they only see a static image.

Controls may fade out when the video is playing, but they must be present for non-autoplaying videos.
Galnospoke20. May 2010, 14:03
Only Theora? Not h264? Nonsense. It is worse then Flash.