It's just the webkit rendering and V8 javascript engine they are using, build into the Opera we know and love. I have 100% confidence that this will make Opera even better.
The question is why did they choose webkit and V8 instead of other technologies.
ClashCityRockerWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:29:40 AM
Originally posted by streunerx:
Me too. .. if any of functions for faster working removed i will switch to other.
Why would they remove that? These things (along with Turbo, M2 and other stuff) are Opera's main USP that differentiates them from the other browsers. None of these features have anything to do with the rendering engine.
streunerxWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:30:24 AM
And it's no argument, that bad sites using webkit prefixes
OlivierWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:35:46 AM
No more Opera Unite, no more Presto... the next step is no more Opera ?! I am sad you never met the success you deserve, Opera was a so good product :/
ameer84Wednesday, February 13, 2013 11:39:22 AM
Very sad news indeed RIP Opera
G-Dragon FansWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:43:34 AM
We do not use Opera for compatibility. We use Opera for it's smoothness, which we do not find in any other browser (especially Chrome). Microsoft's Internet Explorer is made of iron, Chrome is made of dinosaur bones, Opera is made of flowing river. So, if we use Chromium, I am scared Opera will become dinosaur bones as well.
woj-tekWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:47:45 AM
A bit of nooo (nostalgia!) but... Ok, rendering websites in opera was sometimes not-so-good. Nevertheless my mine "buts": - webkit seems like a huuge resource hog (same set of tabs in chrome takes even a few times more memory!) this sucks big time but given that I don't know if it's related to webkit/v8 or chromium/chrome itself it's remains to be seen wheter Opera will keep browser slim - customization - I HATE chrome because of the lack of customization (menus, toolbars, whole UI) and it one wants something then an extension (which takes unbelivable lot of memory) need to be installed - huge downer. - what about userCss/UserJS? will this still work?
tl;dr - if you keep operas memory usage and customizability while bringing in webkit website support then I will be happy )
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:54:24 AM
Originally posted by woj-tek:
- customization - I HATE chrome because of the lack of customization (menus, toolbars, whole UI) and it one wants something then an extension (which takes unbelivable lot of memory) need to be installed - huge downer. - what about userCss/UserJS? will this still work?
+1
QuHnoWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:55:03 AM
Benefits:
Google and Apple will profit from Operas work.
Some few pages might possibly work a little bit better because they don't give out shitty code if Opera is masked.
Disadvantages:
Chromium does not support older machines as well as Opera did. Some people managed to run 12.14 on Win98SE with a small modification of the System.
None of my about 30 custom buttons will work any more.
Several extensions will not be ported, some can not be ported.
M2? Where are you? Will there be an export tool so that at least we can port out Mails to some other client?
Anyone seen IRC lately?
150 tabs open at the same time with a chromium based browser? Sure, and Santa exists too ...
18 years of experience in making a browser are not necessary for building a new "skin" for Chromium. Maxthon and others proved that and they will be very hard to beat.
There *must* be a killer feature (and not that crazy page preloading when searching and wipe-only UI like in IEC) that beats all other -webkits- to dust to give users a reason for sticking with Opera instead of switching to the "original".
GeneralKaneWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:56:51 AM
Does this mean that we're going to be more vulnerable due to a more widely used engine? Being a low popularity browser with its own engine had its own goods in terms of profitability to an attacker. It is not as effective to develop for a small "audience". (Although I won't say there are no attacks, I just imagine fewer itw attacks).
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:02:29 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
Anyone seen IRC lately?
Huh? It's still there.
netmainWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:12:29 PM
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Originally posted by QuHno:
Anyone seen IRC lately?
Huh? It's still there.
well, it was removed on Mac !! and maybe he is talking of lack of further development of the feature.
Alphons van WervenWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:14:11 PM
Come now people, think about it.
WebKit is a gigantic resource hog, it's full of non-standard extensions and it's partly developed by Apple, Google and Adobe. Surely the OP is just joking. After all, why would Opera Software ever want to make a move that most likely will throw our beloved browser back from 300 million to 30 million users? Kudos on the joke, but I ain't buying it.
ameer84Wednesday, February 13, 2013 12:15:37 PM
Seeing the comments this won't be a popular decision at all.
alekksanderWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:19:46 PM
Originally posted by clashcityrocker:
Originally posted by alekksander:
Opera (desktop) will become "just another webkit browser". No more performance, no more security, and what about independence?... chrome is going in "wrong" direction, it aims to be idiot-proof browser for the masses... now opera is going to be the same? For a long time user, that really worries me. that's sad.
It's just the webkit rendering and V8 javascript engine they are using, build into the Opera we know and love. I have 100% confidence that this will make Opera even better. None of the stuff we love about Opera has anything to do with the rendering or JS engine. I doubt you would even notice the difference, except more sites work the way you expect them to, and things are faster.
More time for developers to focus on the things we love about Opera that makes Opera unique.
if i understand correctly, this change will affect for example security and on-battery time, so i'm pretty sure we will notice the difference. good thing is that "all we love in opera" stuff will remain, but still, such change worries me, as i stand for "independent, secure opera" as it is now. this is profanation
BohwaZWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:20:28 PM
Worst idea ever. RIP Opera and thanks for the fish.
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:27:26 PM
Originally posted by netmain:
well, it was removed on Mac !! and maybe he is talking of lack of further development of the feature.
Oh, I'm on Linux. Sure, it doesn't seem to have changed hardly one bit since they introduced it, but that never bothered me.
David GouldWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:34:43 PM
Bit of a shock. Presumably, this kills off Opera Turbo and Mini. Will gestures still work? Will I still be able to put my tab & address bar at the bottom?
I can see the logic but it's not going to be popular.
streunerxWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:39:38 PM
Dirk Schulze dschulze at adobe.com Wed Feb 13 04:33:34 PST 2013
Very mixed feelings. Presto is a great engine. It is really hard to loose a browser engine such as Presto from a lot of perspectives. My tributes to Presto, an awesome competitor in the browser market, and the developers of Presto.
Thanks for the announcement on the WebKit-dev mailing list. Opera is very welcome to the WebKit community. Lets take some steps into the future of the web together.
Greetings, Dirk
found on lists.webkit.org Mailing Lists
DavideWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:41:35 PM
The news was a little sudden but I can understand the reason behind the choice and I support it. Resource wise is best thing you could have done. I only hope you will not pick-up the six weeks major-release schedule or similar because that would be a little annoying.
Antonio SalvatiWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:42:02 PM
Opera
QuHnoWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:46:42 PM
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Huh? It's still there.
Just for clarification: Will M2 and IRC be still there and an integral part of the -webkit- version?
I like Opera. In fact, I have been using it for years. In the past it wasn't always my favorite, because I have had the most problems with Opera than with any other browser, but I still use it and I still like what I see.
The back-end, whether it is Presto or WebKit, doesn't concern the user overly much. If Chrome had a better front-end, if its design was as configurable as Opera or Firefox are, I would already be using Google's browser right beside Opera.
So, please listen, developers: take the front-end of the current Opera desktop browser with all its features, options and extensions and create a new version with the WebKit-engine. If everything works at least as well as right now, I look forward to keeping Opera as my first browser.
But if you go the Google way, by minimizing the browser like Chrome is and taking away what makes me like your application so much, then you will have seen the last of me.
BohwaZWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:00:58 PM
Why not make Presto/Carakan open source instead of throwing all these years of work? And what about Dragonfly? And what about Opera Mini? Do we have to switch to UCBrowser now?
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:01:19 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
Just for clarification: Will M2 and IRC be still there and an integral part of the -webkit- version?
If they won't be, surely they'd have a very hard time holding on to us long-time users. In a sense I'm using Opera 7* plus user styles, UserJS, Link, Turbo, and DragonFly. Or perhaps I should say Opera 8 plus Link, Turbo, and Dragonfly. — the main point being that the way I use Opera probably hasn't fundamentally changed in five years.
(Although perhaps that's not quite true, because I probably haven't really used IRC anymore since Opera 9. Still, my keyboard shortcuts have remained the same and my menus have only undergone marginal changes.)
* Opera 6 didn't have e.g. SSR, fit-to-width, spatial navigation, and a variety of other improvements I liked a lot.
MishaWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:18:32 PM
Well.... now I don't know what to do next. Stay with current Opera 12 forever? Not a case... Move to new Opera/Webkit? I'll definitely try it, but I don't believe it can be better than Chrome.
Search for another browser? Maybe Firefox with a tons of slow extensions... it's an only reasonable alternative.
RIP, Opera, RIP.... I loved you...
DanielWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:27:50 PM
I hope the Webkit-Opera-Implementation will have properly text-selecting (not as Chrome) and smooth scrolling. Then, maybe i will consider using it. And don't drop even more features (like Unite, WIdgets...).
JanghouWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:34:19 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
Just for clarification: Will M2 and IRC be still there and an integral part of the -webkit- version?
I hope so, otherwise I'm getting really depressed, mail has nothing to do with rendering....
Same for killer-features like urlfilter,ini and pre 9.2 keyboard shortcuts, like spatial navigation, (S W E D) keys to jump to headings and links, fast forward annd SHIFT Z (rewind), userJS and userCSS and good privacy settings
Please make a webkit browser with above features and I will be happy.
Oh, and add also the column select method of Firefox for tables, that's lacking in any other browser, and implement real private tabs that don't leak to other private tabs. http://my.opera.com/community/forums/topic.dml?id=944252
And please give info about extension development soon, I liked the magic functions and before script stuff, and I had some in the pipeline.
Originally posted by QuHno:
that beats all other -webkits- to dust to give users a reason for sticking with Opera
Brand it as an European browser, that doesn't fall under the Patriot Act, so it's a better browser for privacy concerned users. Wasn't Opera once the best `porn browser`, maybe it will earn the nickname `best webkit-browser for terrorists` in the feature.
browsemineWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:40:03 PM
I hope Opera gets even faster and has more compatiblity with some websites after switch to WebKit!
tim71Wednesday, February 13, 2013 1:48:30 PM
Originally posted by gdragonfans:
We do not use Opera for compatibility. We use Opera for it's smoothness, which we do not find in any other browser (especially Chrome). Microsoft's Internet Explorer is made of iron, Chrome is made of dinosaur bones, Opera is made of flowing river. So, if we use Chromium, I am scared Opera will become dinosaur bones as well.
Have not seen any of that on Linux for a looooong time. There's much more than Windows out there...
篠崎 麻琴Wednesday, February 13, 2013 1:50:30 PM
Thank you and good bye, Presto.
acadenWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:52:28 PM
Please don't forget about supporting older or more rare devices - one of the reasons Opera has a much wider reach than Chrome.
I personally use Opera Mobile for Android MIPS, Opera Mobile for Android 2.3, and Opera Mobile for ARM v5 (on the Marvell PXA920 shipped on millions of phones in China). Chrome supports none of these platforms!
Mini is not enough. Please keep a full web browser for these devices.
woj-tekWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:58:14 PM
Originally posted by Janghou:
Same for killer-features like urlfilter,ini and pre 9.2 keyboard shortcuts, like spatial navigation, (S W E D) keys to jump to headings and links, fast forward annd SHIFT Z (rewind), userJS and userCSS and good privacy settings
Please make a webkit browser with above features and I will be happy.
+1
MyOpera team, please fix this!Wednesday, February 13, 2013 2:10:16 PM
Sad to see a pioneer bow out. It is truly a sad day for the open web.
xxgooglechromesuckmydick1337xxWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:13:23 PM
Google Chrome & Firefox lagging and crashing when 20 tabs open IE crashes when 5 tabs open
Opera works for 7 days with 120+ opened tabs... and now... it will crash at 20 tabs
RIP.
pierreadWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:17:06 PM
Hey guys, stop complaining. Moving to webkit should only affect the page rendering part, and not the whole stuff around it. Hopefully, Opera engineers will be able to spend less time on the rendering stuff, and more time on the UX and UI. That may be a good move in the end. Wait & see !
minhoWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:17:10 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
150 tabs open at the same time with a chromium based browser? Sure, and Santa exists too
None webkit browser can open many tabs on the same time like Opera, my entire machine becomes slow or freezes
Opera is dead Goodbye Opera and congratulations to devs for destroying Opera Thanks for this stupid decision.
morbitWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:20:03 PM
Will you bundle your own WebKit like presto? I guess no, and that means WebKit will pull in his own insane dependencies similar to chromium
Forte of Opera was low(er) memory/CPU footprint and no GTK(flock of gnome-ish ones, pango, dbus etc)/QT dependencies...
Zak AdelmanWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:20:43 PM
Originally posted by alekksander:
Opera (desktop) will become "just another webkit browser". No more performance, no more security, and what about independence?... chrome is going in "wrong" direction, it aims to be idiot-proof browser for the masses... now opera is going to be the same? For a long time user, that really worries me. that's sad.
Chrome is just a UI and slow plugins, Webkit, the real Webkit, is much faster than Chrome. Don't conflate the two considering Google bastardized it to make Chrome and then crippled it with their poor implementation of worthless plugins.
Originally posted by y2b4u3d:
Congrats I'm sure you have think about it before doing a move like this but what will happen to opera trubo and opera mini is this gonna disappear too?
Turbo is possible with Webkit as well as mini, mini will just need their UI on top of the new engine.
Alphons van WervenWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:27:36 PM
Originally posted by morbit:
Forte of Opera was low(er) memory/CPU footprint and no GTK(flock of gnome-ish ones, pango, dbus etc)/QT dependencies...
Exactly. And WebKit is quite the opposite. On the upside, just imagine the commercials that could be made:
Opera - Made possible by the same people who brought you KDE.
Whoopie, sounds like a blast - NOT.
YongShunWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:31:14 PM
I like Webkit but not Chronium!
I see the loss of HWA and possible directwrite!
MishaWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:33:15 PM
Originally posted by zakadelman:
Turbo is possible with Webkit as well as mini, mini will just need their UI on top of the new engine.
Turbo - yes, possible. But Mini is a lot more than an interface. Server-side is built with Presto, and I'm not sure it is easy to port to Webkit. So, one of two: 1) A lot of work to adapt Webkit to Mini needs 2) Kill Opera Mini...
WolvenSpectreWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:40:11 PM
I am torn whether Opera ASA has got a bad case of Google/Chrome envy or it trying to set itself up as a takeover target for Google to make a better Chrome Browser.
First they copied the large strokes of the Chrome UI and and some of its Google integration to be more like Chrome, killing commonly used features like Server Name Completion.
Then they took the userjs model of browser enhancement and modelled it after the way Chrome did it to do Extensions.
They then got rid of their own extension library and made a near copy of the chrome store.
After that they buried and then 'vanished' Opera Skins in favour of the lesser functionalitied and simpler 'Themes' (yet to be honest I have not talked with a long-time skin user that used themes unless they couldn't find skins anymore). All I can say is thank god for the Internet Archives Wayback Machine!!!
Now they are switching to Webkit/Chromium... you know that technology that is making Chrome one of the chrashiest, unstable, and frustrating browsers I have ever used. It now literally crashes tabs and hangs the browser (with a fresh install and no extentions) more often than a heavily used install of Firefox when it was having its memory leak and extension problems. Hell I have had it repeatedly crash on the google search page and pages with ads for the Chrome browser. And one time using a fresh install of Chromium and a slightly used install of Iron malware infected banner ads ran the fake AV scan scam and without me touching my computer it clicked through the OK and started downloading the Antivirus 20xx infection.
Opera used to be the browser that made the designs and features of tommorw's browsers today. It is beginning to feel like Opera ASA wants Opera to be Google's Browser of Tomorrow today.
I will give it a try, but as a user from the late 90's I am starting to feel that Opera is Marty McFly's picture of himself in Back to the Future and the more things aren't working out the more you fade from the photograph until The Opera Browser isn't The Opera Browser anymore. If that is so it is a sad day indeed. It is like a beloved family business that runs itself into the ground trying to keep up with the large warehouse stores instead of surviving as a premium or artisan business.
doknirWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:43:25 PM
Noooooo ... *!÷#×%ß$¤=) Why??? Too expensive to maintain?
For me, one of the reasons to use opera was alternative engine ... It seems that I'll switch now completely to SRWare Iron ...
- What about M2? Most of use is using M2 as default mail client.
- What about configurations? We still ha have "opera:config" and a lot of stuffs are here... will be all of this also in webkit based Opera? for example: plugins on demand.
- that's all. I'm interested in what we lose not what we get. (what we could get with webkit - and V8 - I have known for months) but I can't imagine what Opera can/will lose.
edit:
- Will be still able to have opened 100 or 200 tabs without problems on older machine as now we can? Or that could handle only presto?
- It means that Opera will be have the same support for features as Chrome without difference? For example in future a multicore support.
- We have a good prototype of HWA and (probably final) webgl... this features are not related to engine (presto) and will not be open-source, am I right??
edit2:
- and shortcuts will be the same as are now or the same as are in chrome/safari? I think that here is not reason to change it but in case... (if someone will answer that)
Zak AdelmanWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:45:20 PM
Originally posted by Kitten85:
...But Mini is a lot more than an interface. Server-side is built with Presto, and I'm not sure it is easy to port to Webkit. So, one of two: 1) A lot of work to adapt Webkit to Mini needs 2) Kill Opera Mini...
What they do server side won't have an effect on the local rendering engine. This is just a lot of unnecessary FUD.
What they do server side won't have an effect on the local rendering engine. This is just a lot of unnecessary FUD.
Local Mini rendering engine is NOT Presto. Presto is on server side. Now, if Presto is removed - it has to be replaced with something. So, where is FUD?
toyoWednesday, February 13, 2013 3:08:25 PM
WTF, Opera? So many years, stood by your side, recommended you to countless other users, respected the independence and path the browser was on. Things were OK?!?
nqqbWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:27:21 AM
Originally posted by ClashCityRocker:
The question is why did they choose webkit and V8 instead of other technologies.
ClashCityRockerWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:29:40 AM
Originally posted by streunerx:
Why would they remove that? These things (along with Turbo, M2 and other stuff) are Opera's main USP that differentiates them from the other browsers. None of these features have anything to do with the rendering engine.streunerxWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:30:24 AM
OlivierWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:35:46 AM
ameer84Wednesday, February 13, 2013 11:39:22 AM
G-Dragon FansWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:43:34 AM
woj-tekWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:47:45 AM
- webkit seems like a huuge resource hog (same set of tabs in chrome takes even a few times more memory!) this sucks big time but given that I don't know if it's related to webkit/v8 or chromium/chrome itself it's remains to be seen wheter Opera will keep browser slim
- customization - I HATE chrome because of the lack of customization (menus, toolbars, whole UI) and it one wants something then an extension (which takes unbelivable lot of memory) need to be installed - huge downer.
- what about userCss/UserJS? will this still work?
tl;dr - if you keep operas memory usage and customizability while bringing in webkit website support then I will be happy
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:54:24 AM
Originally posted by woj-tek:
+1
QuHnoWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:55:03 AM
Disadvantages:
18 years of experience in making a browser are not necessary for building a new "skin" for Chromium. Maxthon and others proved that and they will be very hard to beat.
There *must* be a killer feature (and not that crazy page preloading when searching and wipe-only UI like in IEC) that beats all other -webkits- to dust to give users a reason for sticking with Opera instead of switching to the "original".
GeneralKaneWednesday, February 13, 2013 11:56:51 AM
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:02:29 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
Huh? It's still there.
netmainWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:12:29 PM
Originally posted by Frenzie:
well, it was removed on Mac !! and maybe he is talking of lack of further development of the feature.Alphons van WervenWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:14:11 PM
WebKit is a gigantic resource hog, it's full of non-standard extensions and it's partly developed by Apple, Google and Adobe. Surely the OP is just joking. After all, why would Opera Software ever want to make a move that most likely will throw our beloved browser back from 300 million to 30 million users? Kudos on the joke, but I ain't buying it.
ameer84Wednesday, February 13, 2013 12:15:37 PM
alekksanderWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:19:46 PM
Originally posted by clashcityrocker:
if i understand correctly, this change will affect for example security and on-battery time, so i'm pretty sure we will notice the difference. good thing is that "all we love in opera" stuff will remain, but still, such change worries me, as i stand for "independent, secure opera" as it is now. this is profanationBohwaZWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:20:28 PM
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:27:26 PM
Originally posted by netmain:
Oh, I'm on Linux. Sure, it doesn't seem to have changed hardly one bit since they introduced it, but that never bothered me.
David GouldWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:34:43 PM
I can see the logic but it's not going to be popular.
streunerxWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:39:38 PM
found on lists.webkit.org Mailing Lists
DavideWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:41:35 PM
I only hope you will not pick-up the six weeks major-release schedule or similar because that would be a little annoying.
Antonio SalvatiWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:42:02 PM
QuHnoWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:46:42 PM
Originally posted by Frenzie:
Just for clarification: Will M2 and IRC be still there and an integral part of the -webkit- version?
Originally posted by davegould:
The Yandex -webkit- browser already has Turbo.
PS:
-webkit- !== standard
ElDaniWednesday, February 13, 2013 12:52:08 PM
The back-end, whether it is Presto or WebKit, doesn't concern the user overly much. If Chrome had a better front-end, if its design was as configurable as Opera or Firefox are, I would already be using Google's browser right beside Opera.
So, please listen, developers: take the front-end of the current Opera desktop browser with all its features, options and extensions and create a new version with the WebKit-engine. If everything works at least as well as right now, I look forward to keeping Opera as my first browser.
But if you go the Google way, by minimizing the browser like Chrome is and taking away what makes me like your application so much, then you will have seen the last of me.
BohwaZWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:00:58 PM
FransWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:01:19 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
If they won't be, surely they'd have a very hard time holding on to us long-time users. In a sense I'm using Opera 7* plus user styles, UserJS, Link, Turbo, and DragonFly. Or perhaps I should say Opera 8 plus Link, Turbo, and Dragonfly. — the main point being that the way I use Opera probably hasn't fundamentally changed in five years.
(Although perhaps that's not quite true, because I probably haven't really used IRC anymore since Opera 9. Still, my keyboard shortcuts have remained the same and my menus have only undergone marginal changes.)
* Opera 6 didn't have e.g. SSR, fit-to-width, spatial navigation, and a variety of other improvements I liked a lot.
MishaWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:18:32 PM
Stay with current Opera 12 forever? Not a case...
Move to new Opera/Webkit? I'll definitely try it, but I don't believe it can be better than Chrome.
Search for another browser? Maybe Firefox with a tons of slow extensions... it's an only reasonable alternative.
RIP, Opera, RIP.... I loved you...
DanielWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:27:50 PM
And don't drop even more features (like Unite, WIdgets...).
JanghouWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:34:19 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
I hope so, otherwise I'm getting really depressed, mail has nothing to do with rendering....
Same for killer-features like urlfilter,ini and pre 9.2 keyboard shortcuts, like spatial navigation, (S W E D) keys to jump to headings and links, fast forward annd SHIFT Z (rewind), userJS and userCSS and good privacy settings
Please make a webkit browser with above features and I will be happy.
Oh, and add also the column select method of Firefox for tables, that's lacking in any other browser, and implement real private tabs that don't leak to other private tabs.
http://my.opera.com/community/forums/topic.dml?id=944252
For the rest, here are my thoughts/forecast
And please give info about extension development soon, I liked the magic functions and before script stuff, and I had some in the pipeline.
Originally posted by QuHno:
Brand it as an European browser, that doesn't fall under the Patriot Act, so it's a better browser for privacy concerned users. Wasn't Opera once the best `porn browser`, maybe it will earn the nickname `best webkit-browser for terrorists` in the feature.
browsemineWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:40:03 PM
tim71Wednesday, February 13, 2013 1:48:30 PM
Originally posted by gdragonfans:
Have not seen any of that on Linux for a looooong time. There's much more than Windows out there...
篠崎 麻琴Wednesday, February 13, 2013 1:50:30 PM
acadenWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:52:28 PM
I personally use Opera Mobile for Android MIPS, Opera Mobile for Android 2.3, and Opera Mobile for ARM v5 (on the Marvell PXA920 shipped on millions of phones in China). Chrome supports none of these platforms!
Mini is not enough. Please keep a full web browser for these devices.
woj-tekWednesday, February 13, 2013 1:58:14 PM
Originally posted by Janghou:
+1
MyOpera team, please fix this!Wednesday, February 13, 2013 2:10:16 PM
xxgooglechromesuckmydick1337xxWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:13:23 PM
IE crashes when 5 tabs open
Opera works for 7 days with 120+ opened tabs...
and now...
it will crash at 20 tabs
RIP.
pierreadWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:17:06 PM
minhoWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:17:10 PM
Originally posted by QuHno:
None webkit browser can open many tabs on the same time like Opera,
my entire machine becomes slow or freezes
Opera is dead
Goodbye Opera and congratulations to devs for destroying Opera
Thanks for this stupid decision.
morbitWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:20:03 PM
Forte of Opera was low(er) memory/CPU footprint and no GTK(flock of gnome-ish ones, pango, dbus etc)/QT dependencies...
Zak AdelmanWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:20:43 PM
Originally posted by alekksander:
Chrome is just a UI and slow plugins, Webkit, the real Webkit, is much faster than Chrome. Don't conflate the two considering Google bastardized it to make Chrome and then crippled it with their poor implementation of worthless plugins.
Originally posted by y2b4u3d:
Turbo is possible with Webkit as well as mini, mini will just need their UI on top of the new engine.
Alphons van WervenWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:27:36 PM
Originally posted by morbit:
Exactly. And WebKit is quite the opposite. On the upside, just imagine the commercials that could be made:
Opera - Made possible by the same people who brought you KDE.
Whoopie, sounds like a blast - NOT.
YongShunWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:31:14 PM
I see the loss of HWA and possible directwrite!
MishaWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:33:15 PM
Originally posted by zakadelman:
Turbo - yes, possible.
But Mini is a lot more than an interface. Server-side is built with Presto, and I'm not sure it is easy to port to Webkit.
So, one of two:
1) A lot of work to adapt Webkit to Mini needs
2) Kill Opera Mini...
WolvenSpectreWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:40:11 PM
First they copied the large strokes of the Chrome UI and and some of its Google integration to be more like Chrome, killing commonly used features like Server Name Completion.
Then they took the userjs model of browser enhancement and modelled it after the way Chrome did it to do Extensions.
They then got rid of their own extension library and made a near copy of the chrome store.
After that they buried and then 'vanished' Opera Skins in favour of the lesser functionalitied and simpler 'Themes' (yet to be honest I have not talked with a long-time skin user that used themes unless they couldn't find skins anymore). All I can say is thank god for the Internet Archives Wayback Machine!!!
Now they are switching to Webkit/Chromium... you know that technology that is making Chrome one of the chrashiest, unstable, and frustrating browsers I have ever used. It now literally crashes tabs and hangs the browser (with a fresh install and no extentions) more often than a heavily used install of Firefox when it was having its memory leak and extension problems. Hell I have had it repeatedly crash on the google search page and pages with ads for the Chrome browser. And one time using a fresh install of Chromium and a slightly used install of Iron malware infected banner ads ran the fake AV scan scam and without me touching my computer it clicked through the OK and started downloading the Antivirus 20xx infection.
Opera used to be the browser that made the designs and features of tommorw's browsers today. It is beginning to feel like Opera ASA wants Opera to be Google's Browser of Tomorrow today.
I will give it a try, but as a user from the late 90's I am starting to feel that Opera is Marty McFly's picture of himself in Back to the Future and the more things aren't working out the more you fade from the photograph until The Opera Browser isn't The Opera Browser anymore. If that is so it is a sad day indeed. It is like a beloved family business that runs itself into the ground trying to keep up with the large warehouse stores instead of surviving as a premium or artisan business.
doknirWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:43:25 PM
For me, one of the reasons to use opera was alternative engine ...
It seems that I'll switch now completely to SRWare Iron ...
ahoj1234Wednesday, February 13, 2013 2:44:49 PM
so my questions:
- Is that true? https://twitter.com/runeh/status/301616059729969152 dragonfly has not been in webkit based Opera.
- What about M2? Most of use is using M2 as default mail client.
- What about configurations? We still ha have "opera:config" and a lot of stuffs are here... will be all of this also in webkit based Opera? for example: plugins on demand.
- that's all. I'm interested in what we lose not what we get. (what we could get with webkit - and V8 - I have known for months) but I can't imagine what Opera can/will lose.
edit:
- Will be still able to have opened 100 or 200 tabs without problems on older machine as now we can? Or that could handle only presto?
- It means that Opera will be have the same support for features as Chrome without difference? For example in future a multicore support.
- We have a good prototype of HWA and (probably final) webgl... this features are not related to engine (presto) and will not be open-source, am I right??
edit2:
- and shortcuts will be the same as are now or the same as are in chrome/safari? I think that here is not reason to change it but in case... (if someone will answer that)
Zak AdelmanWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:45:20 PM
Originally posted by Kitten85:
What they do server side won't have an effect on the local rendering engine. This is just a lot of unnecessary FUD.morbitWednesday, February 13, 2013 2:45:56 PM
Dragonfly too, eh?
MishaWednesday, February 13, 2013 3:01:25 PM
Originally posted by zakadelman:
Local Mini rendering engine is NOT Presto.
Presto is on server side.
Now, if Presto is removed - it has to be replaced with something.
So, where is FUD?
toyoWednesday, February 13, 2013 3:08:25 PM
Common... still time to change your minds...
Samed AyanWednesday, February 13, 2013 3:14:21 PM